Thisguy

I love Kats face in panel 3.
She needs to get used to actually speaking those one-liners, pleasing the fans, instead of just whispering them.

So many people will end up underestimating Kat because she is Erbana, not realising that she is as much a power player as the Bandit.

Dabo Ross

I think its probably good she whispered, just because she’s literally interrupting the Mani’s sentence, so such a long thing really wouldn’t sound as great as it would if said after a moment of silence.

eldestdawn

dude gave her an opening by being a major distraction and disrupting her influence ability. and we all know how effective kat can be with a big opening.

Storyteller
Bandit: “Erbana hasn’t been played right for years.” I think the gamers that played back in the day before Erbana became near impossible are going to cringe at memories of what happened to the newbie Mortos and Manis that thought the experienced Erbanas that were by themselves were easy targets. Makes sense though that Kat is good with the playstyle. Her preferred alignment was Demoli, or destructive spell caster. While Erbanas may be healers, it seems that similar to the Demoli’s they can make their attacks count. Kat is good at setting herself up for making those hits count. Add… Read more »
cricricri13
I don’t see Demoli and Erbana being that similar. Let me explain: As a veteran PG player I always see roles in 4 boxes, since most RPGs and indeed most games have this roles under different names, and indeed even the ones that don’t are just skipping one of the boxes and keeping 3 (normally control or support are the ones getting the cut). -Tank: That’s the guy that eats the blows. Think your warrior or Paly in a bigass armor. Slow, lumbering, meatshield. -Hitter: (Or Heavy Hitter) basically the rogue/ranger, attacks fast and hard, capable of dealing massive ammounts… Read more »
Zigraphix

“I could also simply be overthinking it. ”

Yes, I think you are. Aneeka doesn’t seem to be basing the Game on any conventional RPGs, most of which are derivations of one another. While there are certain features common to many games that you can draw comparisons to, I think your “standard four types” system is fairly limited and doesn’t map to the Game well at all. Even in tabletop RPGs, things have evolved quite a bit since the days of Fighter/Thief/Mage/Cleric, never mind that the Game is merging character class and alignment much more thoroughly than most games do.

cricricri13
“I think your “standard four types” system is fairly limited and doesn’t map to the Game well at all. Even in tabletop RPGs, things have evolved quite a bit since the days of Fighter/Thief/Mage/Cleric.” Actually I urge you to point tabletop games that have roles that do not fall within the 4 system. I know the game is more complex than this. HOWEVER: A) Table top games have definetelly NOT advanced past this system. If there are classes you can bet that they all follow either 1 of the roles or a standard deviation where a class follows 2 of… Read more »
retief
If you define your categories broad enough, they will cover everything almost by default. That doesn’t make them that useful. Look at league characters. ADCs clearly count as hitters — they are all about sustained single target damage. Assassins also count as hitters — they are focused on single target burst damage. However, ADCs and assassins fill completely different roles in a team comp. The adc’s job is to burn down tanks, while the assassin’s job is to kill enemy squishies. Completely different targets, completely different playstyle, same “role”. For another example, look at Mass Effect 3 (specifically me3 multiplayer… Read more »
mary

i agree that most classes fit with in those main four but what i think storyteller meant was that both erbana and demoli wait for chances and use them well. they wait for openings in order to cause the most powerful effect.

Storyteller
That is what I meant. And more so that for all that Kat is trying to play as an Erbana, her style in doing so is still closer to Demoli. As Bandit shows, the style is all about doing the most damage in the least amount of time. While he showed his roots as a hero by tipping the island without killing NPCs, Kleya is showing her previous experience with precise, efficient and decisive movements. Or to put it otherwise, she did the most damage she could to the team, (non lethally) in the shortest amount of time/movements necessary. It… Read more »
Kim

storyteller,
you’re right on that at least, erbana is a punisher, not a “hide behind my shield until you leave” turtle

cricricri13
Well let’s analize your examples shall we? After that I’ll tell you why you’re wrong about the roles themselves, and specially your decring of AoE vs single-target damage. LoL: Well this particular game actually had very well explained, separate roles in the past. Now it doesn’t, instead it has this: Assassin Fighter Mage Support Tank Marksman And litterally nothing else. ADC doesn’t exist now. Don’t ask me why I actually preferred the old system, but they had to meddle with what was useful. Let’s still analyze it: -So TANK is the most obvious. Let’s just get that one out of… Read more »
Evilbob
cricricri13 makes good points. I think you’re overfocusing on the details, retief. The whole point of models, which is what cricricri13 is doing, is to create a system of categorization that can best explain most accurately, and most broadly, observable phenomenon. It’s like how in Newtonian physics we generalize that Force due to gravity is gravitational acceleration times mass. Then we learn that g is more accurately expressed as GM/r^2; it only being described as a constant it’s a close-enough approximation AND to make things simpler And honestly, LoL still fits into this paradigm; your argument of separating out Assassins… Read more »
Ro
I’m just waiting for Aneeka to come and read all of this and think “wow, I didn’t think about it that way” and come and tell us that she didn’t base them off of the 6-role thing at all and we’re all just looking way too deeply into this 😀 but seriously, great theory with the 6-role thing. It does fit quite well here, but I agree that some games don’t follow the “role” thing at all and I’m glad they don’t. If all the games you played had exactly the same mechanics, we’d never play any new games because… Read more »
Torrenal
Not a table-top game, but GuildWars 2, at least as initially released, had 8 classes, which could be roughly defined as: 8 multi-purpose classes. No dedicated tanks. No dedicated hitters. No dedicated clerics. No dedicated supporters. Each class had skills that could fill each of these roles to some extent, but you would have a hard time of making any one class a full on stand-up role-specific player. Any one of them might tank a big bad for five or ten seconds… and then drop like a rock, and their performance in other roles was similar. My read on the… Read more »
Kim

She’d better have actually made the game (at least the playstyles), or it’s not gonna be fun!
(Erfworld was designed by a master game designer)

Halfbeard

Off the top of my head:
Shadowrun
Any of the Battletech RPGs
Most nWOD White Wolf splats don’t fall too well into the 4 classes(except werewolf)
Through the Breach
Somewhat Iron Kingdoms

On the video game side
Divinity: Original sin

Ultimately it’s a useful but limited way of looking at games. Especially here where the Game doesn’t seem to adhere to many most modern day game theory. That said, if this interpretation works for you, then as you said Demoli and Herbana would both have aspects of the Control box which works with what it sounded like Storyteller was saying.

Kim

Pardon, but this is simply idiotic.
You have “ranged attackers” — their ability is to target people being shielded.
You have “shields” — their ability is to take damage and keep going (Platemail!)
You have “Glass Cannons” — dish a lot, but can’t take it.
You have “Strategists” — they get the slow spell, they warp spacetime, they change the playspace.
You have “stealth and speed” — this is thief, but it’s also ninja, and ranger in the wood.
And then you have the f***ing wildmage, who doesn’t know what he’s going to cast next. Hide.

Kim

cricri,
Mentalists of all freaking sorts in rolemaster.
How about illusionists? Their main strength is in creating new realities. If you make an illusion real enough, it is indistinguishable from reality…

Nikary
There’s more to the alignments than just the role thing, though. Most classes are usually neutral, not strictly “nice” or “evil”, aren’t they? The only class requiring a specific alignment I can remember on the spot is paladin. And here, we have hero and villain alignments (though they ironically do look pretty neutral – just look at Kat’s evil face). One might argue the loss of neutrality for the classes doesn’t change much, but it does for people like me. I mean, look at me. If I play games with alignments, I go for the nicest and most harmless ones,… Read more »
cricricri13
Actually, in D&D and pretty much all the D&D inspired RPGs, most if not all classes have preferred alignments, tho I think the fighter doesn’t but don’t quote me on that, by default pretty much all the divine guys will be found in good and/or lawful, the primal guys in chaotic, normally chaotic good and the warlocks evil. Because apparently making pacts with cthulhu makes you evil. Now sure it’s just preffered and not required, except for pallys and other god-bound classes, but I’m fairly certain that, for instace, playing a lawful good rogue will end up with you being… Read more »
Nikary

…the feeling when never got to play D&D.

…..aaaanywayyy, yeah, I did say in my earlier comment that these alignments feel pretty neutral. Kesti’s more like a mercenary, and what about fighting to protect people? But the thing is, in Game mechanics these all count as specifically hero or villain.
By the way, I’d say Mani actually is the most evil one out of the three. There’s more to evil than just taking lives, you know.

cricricri13
I will never understand that. Why would mani be more evil than the others? I’d say it’s far, far less evil. It doesn’t need to kill at all, so that’s already a big contrast. But besides that one… You say there’s more evil than taking lives. Ok, fair enought. I’d say we could describe evil as “causing damage or preventing happyness or reparation.” Now… What’s mani really doing that’s so bad there? We know that it makes more money for what bandit said. But it’s obvious than that refers to NPC merchans, so no damage done there. We know it… Read more »
Boxbot
In 3.5 D&D, the non affiliated core classes are: Fighter, Ranger, Rogue, Wizard, Sorcerer, Cleric. The affiliated classes, with their alignment, are: Barbarian (nonlawful), Bard (nonlawful), Druid (At least partially neutral), Monk (lawful), Paladin (lawful good). For those that don’t play D&D – nonlawful is kind of like a weaker version of representing chaotic tendencies – you don’t have to be chaotic, but you can’t be lawful. Interestingly, that means chaotic classes are less restricted in being chaotic. Druids can’t be too unbiased and thus are required to be partly neutral. Also, prestige classes aren’t all so restrictive. Some are… Read more »
cricricri13

Well that’s leaving aside all the supplement classes. Specially the whole “villain” segment. But yeah, good summary for the basic ones. And frankly I don’t feel like going to check every g-d d*** expansion and am pretty sure no one feels like it, so it’ll do XD

neoshadow

Read that Hitter first as Hilter XD

Boxbot

I would argue your four roles are a valid categorization, but not the best one. I’ve always been irked by the existence of “crowd control” in League being used to refer to single-target stuns, and empowered-maximized-born-of-three-thunders-explosive-ice-substitute-snowcasted fireball (aka tons of damage in a 20 foot circle) casters calling themselves “control”. It’s not useful to say “hey that guy’s a control caster” when it could mean slinging fireballs or entangling one target. You could argue that “control” covers -only- area of effect, but then what does single-target debuff fall under?

Sonja

Love Kat’s smile in the last panel! 😀
Although Bandit will recognize this smug attitude. 😉

Screwball

Well, during the 1st quest (find glowey stone :P) what we saw was pretty much what the audience saw, so while not all of these shots would be seen by the viewers (I’m guessing some would be just for us, unless our highly capable Creator says otherwise), it is possible. I can see old Paddy doing this with the camera to build interest in the team. Just as long as they don’t blow Kat’s cover (she can see the code, so she’d know WHERE Paddy’s put the camera), I can see her letting them work the camera angles like this…

Thunder_God_Slice

That is a phenomenal facial expression.

AceOfSpade

Let’s hope the game camera got it, it would make a fantastic poster for Kat’s fans.

Hariman

One enemy trump card: Neutralized.

Never underestimate the power of a running screaming man to be a distraction.

Screwball

If he had the right skills/abilities/equipment, he could then use Kat’s move as a distraction & take 1 or 2 down from the rear…

Sidus

Love it! And that smirk. Hehe.

“Be a cute thing and go fetch some plants, hmm?”

Screwball

Took a while, but found the reference. I bet Kat’s been eagerly waiting for THIS little event to happen…

Sonja

Oh, thanks for the link, I was wondering about this!

TheSquishedElf

I really like Kat’s expression and pose in the last panel. So smug~

USS Lloyd

Amen. to both. Very nice artwork!

BaufenBeast

Hm, now that the mani is out of the way she can probably get rid of everyone else by giving them a quest to buy her plants in the harbor. She can offer healing as a reward, which they need.

Nikary

Way to look like a villain even with a hero alignment.

Alexander The 1st

Is there a such a thing as a sadistic pacifist?

I think Kleya may have just invented it.

AceOfSpade

Weeeeeeell I don’t know about sadistic pacifist but “Cruel Mercy” is a trope…

Screwball

Yep, TVTropes confirms Cruel Mercy is indeed a thing…

Besides, why should the bad guys have all the cool looking stuff, including the bad*ss posses/looks, etc…

Mandy Lemmi

Have you read Worm? Its healer type character embodies this.

Toma

Kat. Still rubbish at acting heroic.

D20

To me, it seems like less of a Good/Evil divide and more of a Lawful/Chaotic divide. I play tabletop RPGs fairly often, and although my GM makes my group play Good I just play Chaotic and get away with insane amounts of killing and such. Kat can’t kill, but she can play in a villain group.

Frequent Visitor #100141
Frequent Visitor #100141

Nice

SilentKnight

BAM! That was so epic.
I also love how Kat is whispering all of that. Makes it extra unnerving.

Alex

Aw, why did Kat whisper that cool one-liner? Her fans would’ve loved it. Well, maybe they would’ve said “Wow, you’d be such a cool villain! I love it when you’re mean!”. 😀

Well, I guess we won’t get to know Bellatrice’s name any time soon. Or the names of the others for that matter.

Soooo, doing a head-count here: Kat and injured Danni vs. Albert, Haudrauf, Langusto, Betty and possibly Jane, because Kat wants to stay Nice. I’m still anxious to find out how that fight ends.

Christopher

I guess it makes sense that many based plants on a mani based island include a CC option.

Of course now that Dominatrix Kleya was here, it will be only known as “Bondage Island”.

Alex
rofl, yeah, plant-BD is something that has been on my mind since forever. I wonder how many comments were censored within the last few months for going into more detail than you. I swear the last couple dozen pages were tempting me soooo often in this regard. Including her Mean Eater when it was _swallowing_ the _big_ Demoli attack. I am such a child sometimes. 🙂 I swear if her next plant has tentacles I will have to log out before posting so I won’t have to decide on whether it should be made public. In fact now that I… Read more »
Alex

@Aneeka: Thanks for making it public! 🙂

Leilatha

That’s….such a perfect name for it xD
Now I can only think of it as “Bondage Island”

Dragon Master

LOVE IT! Kat is AWESOME! Such snark and smugness at a level only she can display and it still be cool.

Kaiden

I just love the abject terror on Mani girl’s face.

Alexander The 1st

“My *one* weakness!”

James

Super aggressive the way she lands her lead foot *beyond* the foe in that first panel. Scary precision and boldness. Would not want to go toe to toe with Kat.

Krahazik

Kat did mention the plants in the local area were the wrong type for healing, guess what type they are good for though ….

Alex

Geared towards controlling of course. 🙂

I wonder if Kat has collected some mind control plants as well. Against big blue-haired guy a plant-wrap-up might not be enough.
Nothing brutal like mind controlling mushrooms (yes, mushrooms aren’t plants, I know), just some plants that can let you take a nap or make you chill out or something like that.

Screwball

Mushrooms the make you chill out or take a nap? Aren’t there something like that in real life… 😛

That said, I know some games have had to edit out things like that because of the same thing in the real world…

Alex

Sure there are, but I refer to another type of mushroom that exists in real life, too. 🙂
Fantasy: http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Parasect_%28Pok%C3%A9mon%29
Real: http://scribol.com/environment/plants/mushrooms-that-take-over-their-victims-minds

So in _some_ fantasy settings they aren’t edited out. 🙂

Ashley

“And the clueless coward once again -” PUNCH IN THE FACE + PLANT MAGIC!

That’s basically how I want to respond to everyone who does nothing but talk big on the internet. Except the plant magic bit. I don’t have that. But I’m sure I’d use it if I had it.

SomeFan

Umm… For some reason, the comic doesn’t load properly anymore, it just appears pixelated as if it stopped loading part way. Yet I can tap and hold (I’m using a tablet) and open the image, it it loads fine. It’s just annoying having to open the image for every new page…. Any ideas?

Torrenal

This page and the last 2, I’ve had the same problem. I sometimes get blurred images if I hit something that cancels a load part way, and can’t fix it till the image falls off my tablets cache, but this last page I was very careful not to hit anything to abort the image load part way. Using an iPad here, had to move to a PC just to read the dialog.

Seii

The whisper is awesome, but that immediately makes me wonder: “Who was she whispering to?” I was under the impression that whispers had to have a destination…maybe that’s incorrect.

AvatarVecna

My current headcanon (which will likely be kverruked in the next comic but whatever) is that she’ whispering to the Mani girl she just pwned. To the girl who taunted her, the Ironic Echo taunts her back, showing how Kat was ready to take her dlwn practically from the start; to all the kthers, it looks like the pacifist got in a lucky shot.

Caryn

HAHAHA! *Love* it!

Wait, is it my imagination, or is Kat developing a sense of humor? 🙂

Eric

We can hope. Her thought/ whisper would have been a good quip to make as the Mani hit the ground.

Eric

Nap time for arrogant, annoying Mani girl. Kat just needed a distraction. I am pleased. 🙂

Marscaleb

…It worked!
IT WORKED!
The Dude saved us!! The Dude saved us!!

Bret

This. This right here is what I’ve been waiting for since we started this Game session.

Webmetz

The latest update inspired me to:
1) Reread NAVCOMIC.com from beginning to end to get all of the alt text.
2) Reread Magicience from beginning to end. http://tapastic.com/series/magience
3) Rewatch TVTome Adventures from beginning to end. http://kirbopher.newgrounds.com/movies/
4) Rewatch .Hack from beginning to end.
5) Start reading and watching Sword Art Online.
6) Replay .Hack games.

I have finished step #1 and #2 of my MMORPG simulator list. Gonna be a good week.

Ira
Ah, it’s like letting the newbie of a team run into the center of the battlefield as you close in and assassinate half the enemy team starting with high priority targets. The sudden loss of key players and confusion that two people can cause is one of my favorite things in competitive multiplayer…best part is, the person taking out the enemy ranks doesn’t even need to coordinate with the distraction, just watch until they draw attention. I love how Kat seems to work. She’s like the dream teammate I’ve only seen a few times; you can trust them to follow… Read more »
ChucklingBoy

I think aside from Danni they are the dream team. At least for the level of play that we have seen in the game. From an execution standpoint I think Kat, Dude, Bandit, and Jane could synergize near perfectly with each other. That their Kat and Jane at the least are at complete cross purposes is the only real problem their high performers have.

Alex

I wouldn’t be so harsh on Danni. She’s currently clumsy for being a Newbie, but she’s down-to-earth, straight as an arrow, hard-working and very cooperative. She and the Dude seem more like people who follow orders while the other three seem to prefer giving them. The latter can be real problematic in any real life game group, especially when leaders are notoriously stubborn, so I think they’re far from being a dream team. Kat is special for having so much extra information and being very skilled, but that’s rarely the case with leaders.

FatedDarkly

A) MAKE THIS A REAL GAME. These roles are awesome.

B) 2nd panel, a very excellent “OH SHHII–” face if ever i saw one. :3

Aline1

Hmm, nice and heroically done in true guile hero fashion. Also why is the heroes that won’t kill you get the scary expressions and laughs?

Daisy

I really love the artwork, layout, and coloring on this page.

trackback

[…] Updates: The Dude ran away screaming from everyone else, but it was all part of an epic wombo combo plan between him and Kat! Score one for the peace-loving Erbana route! Also, gotta love that callback with Kat tossing her “cute one” designation back in her enemies’ faces. Tuesday Thursday […]

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